Off-Topic Forum

It's all rigged! Lol

I will say I don't know why but I always confuse Manny and Ortiz, no real reason, but I do.  I was referring to Manny not Big Papi earlier.  As for Palmeiro, arguments have been made for him, and I can't deny that.  I think I'm still angry the hall never really even considered Johnny Damon who had over 2700 hits and couldn't reach 5%.  As for Sosa, I think the difference between him and McGwire and Bonds are that I don't think "all" of their talent was due to steroids, well Bonds at least.  Sosa I think also had a corked bat which also wasn't too well received.  If he goes in though, again, I can't argue with it because he did bring fans back to the game.

I just don't get some ballots.  I wish some would explain their ballets better and some that leave their ballots blank more than twice in say 5 years should have the priveledges revoked.  The Hall of Fame will be ever changing and really should be era based instead of comparing players to the old timers.

Schilling if anyone

I get more excited for the Veterans Committee selections.

I agree with the era type ballot, Nascar went to something similar last year and it seems to work out fairly well

Do we think during the next few years there will be an increase in Players and Golden Era nominees getting that long-awaited call?

Should those committees include more voters than just twelve? Who has sat out for too long that needs a closer look?

Dick Allen, Thurman Munson, Dale Murphy, Tommy John, Tony Oliva?

Or should the Hall be as exclusive as it can - the argument being if they haven't gotten in by now...

First, I'm reluctantly over the steroids thing. And if that's true, Palmeiro, Bonds, Clemens, McGwire, and Sosa should all be there based on their numbers and influence on the game. 

I'm by no means a Sosa apologist, but "had maybe 3 good years" Jupiter?! Check your stats. He hit over 25 home runs 12 years in a row, including three years with over 60 (only person to do that) and 7 years with over 40. Nine straight years of 100+ RBI. And hit over .300 four times in there, as well. If you ignore the steroids thing, he was one of the best in baseball for a decade. And he was electric and fun and helped save the game. He just cheated, that's all. 

I agree, though, that no one this year. But they can have last year's ceremony, so it's ok. And so many have gone in lately -- something like 22 in the last four years -- that a year off is fine with me. 

I think all the steroid people might have to wait for veteran's committees. 

v3

Curt should be a givin this year but hoping for Bonds as he was accused but never proven for PED's I always got excited pulling his cards from packs. Clemens and a few other admitted so they can go to the waiste side. Until big Pete can get in to the hall of Fame.

SO MUCH that I WANT to say about this, but I'll try to keep it short. Clemens did use steriods but it was mostly to recover from injuries. I still don't condone it and don't think he should get in soon. McGwire, Bonds, Sosa, etc. did it just to get better at what they were doing but I'd accept recovery from injury over just-because as a reason for using steriods. Until Shoeless Joe and Pete Rose can get in the HOF, I don't think ANY of the steroid-era guys should get into the Hall. Manny Ramirez was an awesome player too, but even as a fan of him, I don't think he could get in until the Steriod guys from the late-90's get in. Why is everyone leaving out the possibility that Schilling used too? That has been a question for a long time too. I was at the HOF in 2005 and his bloody World Series sock was on display right beside a giant photo of Sandberg and Boggs (the inductees that year). I have nothing against Schilling getting into the Hall and the sock has nothing to do with my reply except that I saw it and it was a big story back then.

But I want to call back to Dan/vrooomed's list. Of the 25 players listed, I'd only even think about adding a few to the HOF. Schilling, Rolen, Helton, Kent and maybe Vizquel and Sheffield. I don't see a single 1st-year name ever getting into the Hall. They just didn't last long enough at quality to be in there to me. Pettitte and A. Jones could make it in there in the future for their long careers. Most of the guys on the list are just missing career numbers. Many were fantastic for a few years and then they disappeared from the public eye whether it was from injury or trades. If you are going to consider only a few years of a career, Don Mattingly would have been in the Hall over 15 years ago!

Funny that you mention Dick Allen! MLB Network aired a thing tonight about the best All-Time 1st-basemen and Dick Allen was on both lists. I also agree that Munson, Murphy, and Oliva should be in the Hall. I can't say the same for Tommy John as a player. But he should be in the Hall. He is a worldwide name due to the injury and then the surgery that bares his name. That's one of the greatest impacts a player can make on a sport is to have an injury and its corrective surgery named after you. That has saved the careers of so many players since Tommy suffered through it. Not just in the MLB, but all sports on the planet.

Pettitte falls into the PED catergory though so if he was ever to get in it has to be well after McGwire Sosa et al .

Coming from a Mets fan I always liked Munson and he probably would have been a HOF'er ages ago had he not died tragically (but he deserves it anyway as him and Fisk were the best catchers in the AL throughout the 70's )

If a player like Mazeroski is there strictly for his defense then guys like Mattingly deserve it as well as he was the premier 1B until the injured back took ut's toll on him (IIRRC he has spinal stenosis )